[R-G] Interview with Jean Bricmont, author of 'Humanitarian Imperialism
fentona at shaw.ca
Sat Sep 22 19:47:55 MDT 2007
Copyright 2007 NoticiasFinancieras/Groupo de Diarios America
All Rights Reserved
IPS (Latin America)
September 21, 2007 Friday
LENGTH: 1367 words
HEADLINE: Interview with Jean Bricmont, author of 'Humanitarian
Q&A: War in the Name of Peace
In 1999, the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation lacked any mandate
from the United Nations when it attacked Serbia. In Afghanistan, the
U.S. continued bombing in 2002, even when the government that
replaced the Taliban asked it to stop (lest the civilian death toll
And the United States asserted a highly disputed entitlement to
launch a pre-emptive strike against Iraq a year later, citing bogus
claims that the country had weapons of mass destruction and had
played a role in the Sep 11, 2001 attacks.
In his new book 'Humanitarian Imperialism', the pacifist intellectual
Jean Bricmont exposes how human rights have been used to justify
military exploits that he regards as legally dubious and morally odious.
A 55-year-old professor of theoretical physics in Belgium's
University of Louvain, Bricmont is also editor of 'Chomsky', a new
collection of articles on the linguist and trenchant political
analyst Noam Chomsky.
Bricmont spoke to IPS Brussels correspondent David Cronin.
IPS: You have suggested that NATO's bombing of Serbia in 1999 was a
turning point for a new form of imperialism. Why do you think so?
JB: There were several reasons against that war but there was so
little reaction from people on the left. If you exclude a very small
number of individuals who knew better, everyone was convinced the war
was necessary and the U.S. should intervene for humanitarian reasons,
irrespective of the particularities of the case.
I don't agree that it was a good thing to destroy international law.
I don't agree that the situation in Kosovo was so dire, that it was
necessary to bomb (Serbia). And I don't agree that the removal of
(then Serbian president Slobodan) Milosevic was a good thing,
irrespective of everything else.
Milosevic was elected. Maybe his election was not pure. But there is
no pure democracy in the world. In France, you need six times as many
votes to elect a communist in urban areas as you do to elect a (right-
leaning) Gaullist in rural areas. But nobody says France is not a
IPS: Much of 'Humanitarian Imperialism' deals with Iraq. Why do you
reject the widely held view that the oil industry should be blamed
for the war there?
JB: Of course, oil had a role to play in a trivial sense. The U.S.
doesn't want Iraq's oil under the feet of Iran, Saudi Arabia or even
the present Iraqi government.
But the naïve view of the peace movement that the U.S. went there to
rob oil doesn't seem defensible. I don't know of any evidence that
the oil industry lobbied for war.
Every war needs war propaganda. And the oil industry -- to my
knowledge -- have not done any war propaganda at all.
The Zionist lobby, on the other hand, have always done war
propaganda. If you open an American newspaper, you will find columns
that are written by people who are Zionist and pro-Israel, even if
they are not all Jews. It is fair to call (President George W.) Bush
and (Vice-President Dick) Cheney Zionists, even if they are not
Jewish. Especially Cheney.
IPS: The U.S. invasion of Iraq in 2003 was preceded by huge protests
across Europe. Why has the peace movement lost that momentum?
JB: I'm not a sociologist but if I can resort to conjecture: many
people went out in the streets because they thought the war would
turn ugly. Of course, it did turn ugly but not in the way that was
thought. There were no weapons of mass destruction. And don't forget
that (then British prime minister) Tony Blair was talking about
missiles being launched within 45 minutes.
The people in the peace movement were either genuinely anti-war or
genuinely concerned about the interests of their own countries.
There are different situations in different countries. In Britain the
anti-war movement faced a problem of deciding who to vote for. The
Conservatives are as gung-ho as Labour. And with the Liberal
Democrats, the system is biased against them.
IPS: Given your criticism of Israel's tactics in the Palestinian
territories, do you think there is a case for boycotting Israeli goods?
JB: Yes, there should be a campaign for a boycott. That is one way
that citizens have to show they are angry.
Some people say: why not boycott the U.S.? I think we should boycott
the U.S. but I don't see how this could be done practically.
In Britain and the U.S., a large part of the population does not
agree with the government. In Israel, there is much more homogeneity.
Even the moderates in the genuine peace camp are very moderate.
IPS: Reviewers have pointed out that your book doesn't examine the
situation in Darfur. What should the West do about the killings there?
JB: My book is not against intervention within the framework of the
UN. In principle, maybe something could be negotiated there. A
peacekeeping force can be sent when there is a peacekeeping agreement
to prevent rogue elements from destroying the peace. But when you
send a peacekeeping force before you have a peacekeeping agreement,
that is war.
It also seems to me that some people are using Darfur to change the
subject away from Iraq. Iraq may be the worst humanitarian crisis in
the world. You have three-four million refugees and maybe one million
IPS: You are quite critical of human rights organisations for being
selective in deciding what rights they focus on. Why is that?
JB: Human Rights Watch says it will not discuss whether a war is
legitimate or not. All it wants is for war parties to respect the
Geneva Convention. The Geneva Convention is not respected in any war.
IPS: You've also written that the left in Europe is only moderately
less in favour of unfettered capitalism than the right. Can you
explain what you mean by that?
JB: It is amazing how after the fall of communism, democracy became
the new cause. The left adopted this and turned it into a pro-
Western, anti-Third World discussion.
Look at the way the left complains about China. When the Chinese said
recently that they want to improve the rights of workers in Chinese
factories, big Western corporations said: 'If you do that, we will
move abroad, we will move to Vietnam.' This is not something the left
is concerned about. It just blames the Chinese leaders for everything.
IPS: Can I ask you about the European Union and the current efforts
by its leaders to introduce a reform treaty that is largely the same
as the constitution rejected by voters in France and the Netherlands
in 2005. I understand you were pleased by the 'No' vote in France?
JB: I wasn't entirely happy. I was happy that at least the media was
But I have no illusion about why people voted 'No'. They voted
because of nationalism. Fifty-five percent of people voted 'No' and
of that 35 percent were from the left and 20 percent were from the
There is nothing telling me that that the reason why people on the
left voted 'No' was all for social reasons and not for reasons of
nationalism. With the victory of (centre-right candidate Nicolas)
Sarkozy (in a presidential election earlier this year), a lot of
people who voted for him had voted 'No'. People over 65 who voted
overwhelmingly for Sarkozy had voted 'No'.
The failure I see in Belgium at the moment (where Dutch and French-
speaking parties have not yet formed a coalition government several
months after a general election) could anticipate the future of
Europe. Why should the Finns, Portuguese, Irish and Greeks be feeling
closer to each other, more than Flemish and Walloons feeling closer
to each other?
Without a common feeling, how do you build a country with bureaucracy
and free markets? There is an enormous amount of delusion (about
IPS: Finally, I've been told that you are the man who effectively
introduced Noam Chomsky to francophone Europe. Is that true?
JB: I first met Chomsky when I went to listen to him in Princeton
(the U.S. university) in the early 1980s. After the first Gulf War, I
invited him to Belgium to speak at the Flemish university VUB.
In France it has been an uphill battle to put him on the map.
(Journalist) Philippe Val wrote an attack on him in (satirical paper)
Le Canard enchaîné recently because (Osama) bin Laden mentioned him
in his recent video.
He is still being demonised and misrepresented. © 2007
NoticiasFinancieras - IPS - All rights reserved
More information about the Rad-Green